A lot of hue and cry was raised over the so-called census of Muslims in Indian Army. After the Sachar panel had hinted that the number of Muslims in the armed forces could be sought, there was opposition from several sections against the proposed headcount on basis of religion.
There is no official report. However, the strength of Muslims is roughly around 3 % and the figure comes around 29,000 in the million-strong Indian army, according to news channel CNN IBN's programme titled Minority Report.
If the number of Muslims serving in Jammu and Kashmir (J&K) infantry that has over 50% Muslims and those in other wings not directly dealing with warfare are excluded, the proportion is definitely too low. So out of a Muslim population of nearly 150 million (15 crore), barely 29,000 Muslims were found suitable for Army.
There has been a lot of controversy but these figures don't surprise or sadden me. The fact remains that if competent, a Muslim can rise in India to the highest position in any services including army, and has more chances than any other country.
This is my belief despite all the charges of discrimination, communal riots and experiences of bias. There are Muslim officers serving in Indian army at senior levels. IH Latif rose to the position of Air Chief Marshal.
In communal riots, army has always been welcomed by Hindus and Muslims alike, as the local police is often charged of biases. But army's neutrality remains undisputed. Lately there have been efforts to increase the strength of Muslims and other minorities in army, paramilitary forces and police. These steps will hopefully change the situation.
Thursday, March 16, 2006
Indian Army's Muslim headcount: 3% or just 29,000
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45 comments:
When these guys are going to learn?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/4819988.stm
What Sue?
very rarely one can identify a christain,parsee,buddhist or maharashtran,south indian in a crowd of boys and girls.
but its easy to identify a muslim boy or girl in the crowd.
dont u find this problematic.
Oh no. All the time since my childhood I have heard this 'You don't look like a Muslim'. I didn't know whethere to take it as a compliment or a cruel joke. And even if there are many Muslims who are distinguishable then I don't find it too odd---the beauty of our country...such diverse people. In a decade or so, the difference will not remain pereceptible. Metros like Delhi had very less percent of Muslims compared to their popualation in the country (Delhi had just 5% Muslims until mid-eighties) and seeing the socio-economic backwardness even fewer came to the institutions, colleges so they probably looked different.
I never knew you could casually tell a Muslim guy among non-Muslims (unless of course, the Muslims guy was wearing the long 'kurta').
I have never found it possible, and I have seen other people make wrong guesses too.
Anyway, what difference does it make?
yep.. maybe this is a problem.. and why do you think this is??
i have problem when certain communities force their people to follow certain dress code.
When someone tells me that i dont look like a south indian i feel proud.the reason being i dont want to be identified by my religion,caste,colour etc.
because it does not make any difference to u or me if i was a muslim,christian or sikh.
sHOULDn't then there be an effort to blurr such identification by one and all.
Well then you would get into things like the banning of headscarves (and turbans) in French schools. I think it's ok to advertise which groups you belong to, that's part of who you are as a person. I think we have to get to a point where people are not treated differently based on what they look like or which group they belong to.
HYDERABAD BASED MUNSIF AND SIASAT URDU DAILY EDITORS GRAB WAQF LANDS
Urdu Media War and the Wakf properties tussle in Hyd ; MiM Leader Akbaruddin Owaisi
(Friday, Dec 09, 2005 - 09:00 pm) TeamMedia war among Urdu dailies was taken to Assembly in Hyderabad, when MIM floor leader Akbaruddin Owaisi accused Siasat and Munsif Urdu daily owners of grabbing Wakf properties and demanded stern action against them.Mr Owaisi armed with statistics and details of all Waqf Lands which are being encroached upon said govt is going soft on these editors as they are trying to threaten the govt through there newspapers .In the same breath, He also alleged that no action was taken against grabbers of Wakf properties in city and outside including Viceroy Hotel, Shaam and Sensation theatres, local reports inform. Turning his ire on owners of rival Urdu dailies, Siasat and Musif, he said, "Mr Zahid Ali Khan has illegally encroached Wakf property. He is a white collar land grabber. Why is the government keeping quite? You should put them behind bars." Shifting his heat on another Urdu daily Munsif owner, he remarked, "Mr Khan Lateef Khan...the double Khan.. too has encroached Wakf properties housing Santosh and Sapna theatres, yet no action has been taken. The government should take stringent action against encroachers of Wakf properties," he alleged. Reacting to Mr Owaisi's demand, minister for minorities welfare Mohd Fareeduddin assured that the government would enquire into the matter and would not "spare anyone however big he might be." Referring to allotment of land to one Tajuddin, he said the land was given on a lease for three years for agricultural purposes and the renewal would depend on the government He also accused them of trying to cover there illegal grabbing of land by bribing some high officals in the govt .
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A Hyderabad based urdu newspaper siasat editor mr amir ali khan and mr mazhar and mr alamdar were involved in a sex racket today as exposed by MIM floor leader in the state assembly in which a young girl was sold to alleged sex racket after being brought in a trap by offering her a scholarship and then taking her to a farmhouse and raping her which are seirous offenses and even forcing her parents not to file a police complaint and threating them with dire consequences.
Muslims are easily identified in a crowd because they are viewed negatively. If not all but majority of the people do. I dont want to generalise but atleast this is the case in india. I dont know there is this mistrust amongst muslims and the rest in india. I am gujrat in india and have seen the riots. A muslim and a hindu who had been best friends since 10 years ended up fighting wih each other and raping each others wife and daughter. How can this hatered just come up.
Majority of muslims in india are poor. every riot that occurs, puts the muslim community 10 years back. so technically if all the riots are calculated, muslims are living in the year 1967. Now due to this the standard of living is very low.
Anoter thing is that indian muslims are not considered as indian. They are taken as pakistanis. This is one major thing that fuels problems.
In all this muslims are to be blamed as well. Clapping is done eight two hands.
i can never find that person is muslim or not well i came to know this site from diggindianews .com
Muslims in India are Indians they are our people. You paki get the your fucking eye out of our country.. We have fights in between and we know hoe to settle,, no one from outside need to come for that..
headcount should be reduced to 0%.
i am from kerala,india, where the 3 religions christianity hinduism and islam have almost the same percentage of population. There is a unity and love among all. i don't think this is because of the balancing of the percentages. i think it is because there is 99% literacy in kerala. people are educated and cannot be misused by politicians for religious matters. Everybody celebrates evrybodys festivals whether it is diwali, x-mas or bakrid. it is something encouraged from school level.i believe that is what is lacking in the rest of the country. Education helps!!
Oh my god….so 29,000 “could be” problem makers in the Indian Army…??? Well, “”ALL MUSLIMS ARE NOT TERRORISTS; BUT TERRORISTS ARE MUSLIMS””. Just take any national or regional Newspaper and read the crime news……. 99% percent of the culprits will be an Ali, Ahmed, Muhamed, Riyaz, Siad…..and so on. This is not just a proclamation, try yourself.
Moreover, I wish all the Muslims in the world go through the website “”” www.apostatesofislam.com “”””.
I find the Holy Koran is more like “Indian Penal Code” than a religious book.
Finally I must say that some of my best trusted friends are Muslims.
Oh my god….so 29,000 “could be” problem makers in the Indian Army…??? Well, “”ALL MUSLIMS ARE NOT TERRORISTS; BUT ALL TERRORISTS ARE MUSLIMS””. Just take any national or regional Newspaper and read the crime news……. 99% percent of the culprits will be an Ali, Ahmed, Muhamed, Riyaz, Siad…..and so on. This is not just a proclamation, try yourself.
Moreover, I wish all the Muslims in the world go through the website “”” www.apostatesofislam.com “”””.
I find the Holy Koran is written more like “Indian Penal Code” than a religious book.
Finally I must say that some of my best trusted friends are Muslims. So deep inside I respect their feelings but just expressed my views…
THERE IS A REASON BEHIND THIS LOW PERCENTAGE. HISTORICALLY IN INDIA PEOPLE WHO JOIN FORCES BELONG TO NORTHERN REGION, SAY PUNJAB,HIMACHAL,HARYANA ETC. HOWEVER DURING PARTITION MOST OF THE MUSLIMS MIGRATED FROM THESE REGION.WHATEVER LEFT ARE SO POOR THAT THEY CANT FEND FOR EVEN A SQUARE MEAL FORGET THE THOUGHT OF JOINING ARMED FORCE. ALSO IT IS TRUE THAT PRESENT DAY MUSLIMS DUE TO THEIR BACKWARDNESS AND LACK OF MODERN EDUCATION , ANYWAY CANT COMPETE WITH AVERAGE INDIAN YOUTH AND JOIN THE FORCES. IN THIS PROBABLY NCC CAN PLAY A MAJOR ROLE IN THAT THEY SHOULD GO TO ALL THESE MADARSAS AND ENROLE THESE YOUNG FAITHFULLS AND MOULD THEM INTO A MODEL CITIZEN.
REGARDS
NEYAZ
Muslims in India are the "most cunning lots" who enjoys all the benefits of being minority(though they are over millions!), enjoy Political support and yet do all sort of crimes(its in records). Muslims in India exist millions times better than Muslims in Pakistan. I can just ask one simple query to the Indian Muslims, DO YOU PEOPLES ever think of HINDU Minority in Pakistan?? How are they kept? they cant even worship in Public, and you guys Block roads and shout your NAMAZ in Fridays! what the hell more freedom you want. If India is so bitter, why dont you leave it and get lost ? and if you really has talent?? why dont you get what you want , why keep begging like beggars for reservations? Dont have any shame ?oops am sorry ! am talking to some Muslim ! where shame doest exists.
i am a retired indian army officer.
in 1971 thirty three men died under my command. thirty of them were muslims. all my life i have found both discrimination and no-discrimination by ALL communities. views depend on what you see, like a frog sees in his own well. figures are misleading. minimum qualification for recruitment now is MATRIC.how many qualify?
Lastly when i die i'm condemned to hell. wether a muslim/xian/hindu/sikh/jain/buddhist
hell.
which one PLEASE.
Believe me despite being a Muslim, and despite having the personal; experience of discrimination & bias and all, I believe that had Muslims been in Majority in India, they would ahve made the life of a Hindu minority hell.Only a cerain microscopic & political percentage of Hindus are diehard communalists. You see muslim young guys...discussing at every corner of their arae, politics of Pakistan, Iraq, & Palestine with whom we hardly have to do anything or they hardly count us. Unemployment, Illiteracy and the crookedness of the muslim political & commercial leaders, also of the Muslim elites..are the main causes.Not Hindus. Mohammad Azam Khan from Bihar : azamdream@yahoo.com
This is just because of your illletracy and not working on gound realities.I have been born abd brought up in allahabad muslim majority place where most of my friends were muslim.Because of of family I am MBA and working with international Bank in dubai however except Hamza (who got through IIT )none of my other muslim friends are in good status. Either they are working in local shops or roaming here and there after increasing population of India.
six generations of my family(mslims) have served in the indian army (since late 1800s), and continue to the present day. anyway, the first victoria cross awardee was a muslim. i am not sure of the reasons for this low headcount, but i hope something is done about it. and i don't see why anyone should have hangups about why its easy to identify muslims. what's the beauty of culture or dress if everyone looks like factory clones of each other. and anyway, since so many non-muslims are so against muslims they have additional reasons to cheer - they can easily identify muslims if they ever want to beat them up :P
Any reason why you think there should be more Muslims in army. Does the army should go to each and every Muslim house and plead Muslims to join army so that there can be 20% Muslims in army as per %age of their population, do you mean there should be 20% Muslims in every organization in this country...this is sick mentality, carrying victim mentality and consuming conspiracy theories and blaming others for their woes..
Thanks to Gen Cariappa, read this
http://www.hinduonnet.com/fline/fl2021/stories/20031024000707800.htm
sikhs are just 1.89% of population but they have given many great worriers to indian armed forces.then why a community of over 13% did not contribute in indian armed forces.
i have not listen any muslim general,soldier who got any famous galantry award.
Anonymous said: ""DO YOU PEOPLE ever think of HINDU Minority in Pakistan?? How are they kept? they cant even worship in Public, and you guys Block roads and shout your NAMAZ in Fridays!""
Excuse me??!! Hindus in Pakistan cannot worship in public?? Check this link -
http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2008\09\30\story_30-9-2008_pg7_45
Hindus and Muslims were living with peace since 1857 but this is when British realizes that if they want to rule- they have to do something and after 1857, they managed to create a vacuum between two communities.
Jinnah and Nehru were tools only- Mahatma Gandhi was not a threat at all...so they managed with ease with their famous policy of DIVIDE AND RULE.
Now coming back to post in question- There is no doubt that Indian muslims , be it educated or uneducated class- always treated in India as second citizen. Some political color also helped in building this fire and what I am trying to say here is- that some muslim leader were also involved in this cheap and shameless politics of India.
Why i say so? Because no muslim leader after 1947 tried to work for his community and this was one big factor for muslim being backward and treated liked this in India.
I am sure my words will gather lot of venom from people having pre-conceived ideas and half baked truth but this is true that Muslims were never treated in India as Sikhs, Jain and Buddhist were treated. Even Christians are treated well- but Muslims ?
No way !!
So- my friends !
This was natural that a hypocrite society which says we are democratic and claims secular environment is nothing more than a por drama which I am sorry is well known to all likes of US/UK/UN but Muslims of India could not see it.
To Nadeem kasmani !
I can only imagine how you feel but what I concluded is that I am not a proud Indian at all.
From those who rape those wives and daughters- I feel shame and remorse...please accept helplessness of people like me because only way to stop such people is violence and I am sure this is not far away from us now.
I do not want to justify anything but one thing is sure- Delhi has always done the famous British formula of Divide and rule.
see guys....whatever it might be,whether u are a hindu or muslim...just forget everything whatever has happened....we all are indians finally....we are rather now educated to choose what is right....now let us all indians focus to develop our country..........that's it !!!!!!!!
Hi Guys,
I'm an officer in the Indian Army for more than 2 years now.
When I cleared my CDS, my own family had their own ideas about the selection procedure in the SSB.
Firstly, I was from the state of Assam, linked to ULFA. Secondly, I was a muslim. Very few muslims are selected. But, I cleared in the very first attempt.
Throughout my training and sercive till date I never felt any kind of biasness towards me.
I'm serving with the Rajput Regiment, and the only muslim officer in the Battalion. But being only among 1 out of 800 soldiers, I never felt a thing. They are all my brothers and am treated like one. Brother at arms.
By all this what I meant to express is please have a open heart towards others. And kindly keeps your stupid reservations about the Indian Army out of your mind.
As to why there are so few muslims,
1) check the ratio of the religions in the country and definitely the history of the different regiments. Be a little practical.
2) There are many muslims who have recieved gallantry awards. You guys don't know your history well. Who was CQMH Abdul Hamid, 4 Grenadiers.
3) Most of the muslims even before trying feel they are not going to get selected (like my family), they even don't try, and they are more busy gossiping about others and spreading hatred.
4) Those who don't make it, give up instantly, and like the Fox, says the grapes were sour. Just be practical, don't blame your incapability on others.
For your facts, about over 1,00,000 candidates appear for the written exam, only about 8000 clear it and then the best 550 are selected for 4 military academys, viz. IMA, OTA, NA, AFA. And for your info, I was over all 65 out of 550. Yet I am a muslim.
One final thing, the Quran says, it is the final and only book for the Muslim, then why do we need so many hadiths. We are betraying the Quran and the direct order from God.
And guy, for the preservation of reading it in arabic only. Come on be practical, who has the time to master the language and then read it. Rather, pick up a translated copy of the language you can actually read. It's a very beautiful religion, just that we all have failed to understand it.
And yes, all those who die during riots, be muslims, hindus or any religion, are just those poor low class people. Mostly day labourers, rickshaw puller, slum dwellers, they the all just the weak oppressed lot. Very few of the middle class people die. And what about all those leader who agitate the crowd, they have never died.
It's all politics. The britishers had used it, Nehru and Jinnah had used it. And now the present politicians are using it. And the general mass is just a fool.
If you read between the lines here in the comments, can't you recognise the very general hatred against the muslims, presumably by non-muslim commenters?
Amidosh! 3% is a big number. Non muslims in Pak army? Exactly 2, one Sikh and one Hindu.
it is really a shocking news.
MashAllah a cool blog. keep it up my brother.
its a proof that making of Pakistan was right but partiton was not done right and many muslim states where also given to india.
@ Islam Nasheed:
That's your view. But it seems we are in a much better position in India. Nobody can change history but look what is happening in Pakistan--the daily blasts and bloodshed. We are happy and much more safe in India.
its happening in pakistan from last 2,3 years my brother. but muslims of kashmir facing indian torcher from 62 years. Gujrat, ahmedabad, babri masjid. everyweek several things happens but media hides it in india with muslims.
you are right brother Ali. and all this in Pakistan is due to American presence in Afganistan.
This is all foolish things, we guys are discussing here. The main thing is that we need to learn the politics that these
politicians are playing on we people.
And believe me we muslims and hindus, ourselves are fools in from of them and they are taking benifit of all this
foolish ness and illetracy.
Do you ever think that any business men ever thought of religion.... no never because he has to earn.
Lets us suppose if we start a business then do we ever think that our product should go to a certain religion ... no never
... because our main aim is money not religion... Money to fill up my pockets and my labours' pockets with out thinking
if he is a hindu or muslim.
China is growing at very high rate WHY do you ever thought of it ... Lemme tell you :-
In China they have made a rule that no body can disclose his religion via dressing or jewelery or via any other sorts. If
anybody found showing his religion by any means then he would be thrown behind the bars, what ever you do do it with
in your home limits, so no show offs at all means to say that people living in china are chineese, but we people living in
India are not Indians but are hindus, muslims , shikhs, christians, Jains and so on
Britishers make use of this thing, how could we forgot ? we fought together for our freedom, BUT here we again started
fighing WHY?..... because we do want some body to rule over. We cannot led this Nation because we do not have mind,
to understand , to lead , and to put India in to the list of Development Countries.
Instead of taking revange from our family members, from our brothers, lets unite and take revange from the British who
ruled over India for 200 years.
Lets take India ahead of every Nation, Lets the bring India to the Golden age again.
Instead of fighting into such use less and issues lets unite and show this world that we are not known as muslims or
hindus or sikhs or christians.
We are Indians.
LETS UNITE TO MAKE INDIA A RELIGION.
(Unity is strength)
how does that matter if we say we are muslim, and pray five times a day? are our contributions for the greater development of indian economy, scientific development and greater good tarnished simply because of our faith? i really feel pity. if this is the attitude we have, then who will think of taking this country to become a super power? if we the youth do not stop or at least condemn state sponsored anti christian riots, anti sikh riots, anti muslim riots or anti dalit riots, who will do that? i do not think these selfish and crooked politicians are going to do anything for us or our country or for us. so if i work in an organization, and try to benefit them by my knowledge and skill sets, help the earn profit or in cost saving, would you still say i am a terrorist just because i pray five times a day? although i do not have a long beard, and i do not wear kurta? no matter how much people term me terrorist for that, they can't change my mind and make me a fanatic or a terrorist. as i know what Islam is, not by hearing from others but by reading and understanding it from the holy Quran and sayings of Prophet Muhammad(s.a.s.) which forbids us to turn to violence and harm innocents. Love For All Hatred For None.
First get rid of your Arabic names. It is quite awkward to call an Indian who is named in some foreign language.
Mr Anon....how silly it is for you to call yourself INDIAN when India the name given by English. Hindustani is also Persian. Why dind't you call yourself Bharatiya only. By the way you don't have a name and you are an 'Anonymous'.
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